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PostSubject: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 1:50 am

I'm getting really tired of all of the dumb asses complaining about spam. YES IF YOU ARE THREATENED BY SPAM WHILE PLAYING THIS GAME, THIS IS DIRECTED TOWARDS YOU. Spamming almost ANYTHING in this game is quite possibly one of the least intelligent things you could do while playing it. Losing to someone who's spamming almost ANYTHING is even less intelligent. The fact that you can punish with pretty much any characters U1, U2, and most definitely a U3. Not to mention the most broken part of this game... KNJ'ing! That's right everyone, contrary to popular belief, you CAN press the trigger buttons (360) to perform a sub-sti-tu-tion jutsu literally saving you from any situation give or take a few which are pretty hard to get out of. Ya'know what that means? :D Anyone who's spamming something at you is most likely mentally impaired because you can punish the hell out of them with pretty much anything making them lose the game in the process and making your adorable self win the match. Asking to ban spamming from tournaments is like asking to ban players from not trying to win.. or even talking about spamming as a viable threat makes you a stupid person. Now I realize that there are many new players who are still learning, and figuring out the mechanics of the game and that's fine. But the fact that I'm seeing more and more people, even those who've been here for a little while, complain about spam makes me think that you're an idiot. Thanks and have a good day :D
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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 1:58 am

Luminssence wrote:
I'm getting really tired of all of the dumb asses complaining about spam. YES IF YOU ARE THREATENED BY SPAM WHILE PLAYING THIS GAME, THIS IS DIRECTED TOWARDS YOU. Spamming almost ANYTHING in this game is quite possibly one of the least intelligent things you could do while playing it. Losing to someone who's spamming almost ANYTHING is even less intelligent. The fact that you can punish with pretty much any characters U1, U2, and most definitely a U3. Not to mention the most broken part of this game... KNJ'ing! That's right everyone, contrary to popular belief, you CAN press the trigger buttons (360) to perform a sub-sti-tu-tion jutsu literally saving you from any situation give or take a few which are pretty hard to get out of. Ya'know what that means? :D Anyone who's spamming something at you is most likely mentally impaired because you can punish the hell out of them with pretty much anything making them lose the game in the process and making your adorable self win the match. Asking to ban spamming from tournaments is like asking to ban players from not trying to win.. or even talking about spamming as a viable threat makes you a stupid person. Now I realize that there are many new players who are still learning, and figuring out the mechanics of the game and that's fine. But the fact that I'm seeing more and more people, even those who've been here for a little while, complain about spam makes me think that you're an idiot. Thanks and have a good day :D

lol looks lik you overheard somethin. LOL
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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 2:00 am

i hav 2 say dat i agree wit lumi. spamming is something that is easilly punishible & ppl who spam r rly easy 2 get around. ppl get overwhelmed by someone doing the same thing over and over because they are used to ppl doing a variety of different attacks, but this is not always the case. some ppl who hav no skill and only know 1 move will continue to do it the whole match. once u no how to get around the atk is when the opponent is forced to show some skill or face defeat. sometimes it takes practice & if necessary keep fighting the spammer until u learn how 2 get around them. spammers are a natural part of an online community, learning how to deal with them is what separates u frm them
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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 2:59 am

DJ no one wants to hear you rant.
Snip it, if I wanted to see a lecture about this I'd say it myself.

But from you, I dont think it matters what you say.
Its a game, people. People will spam, they lack skill.

If you have skill, then your skill > Spam

Thats basically all.
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[DJ]
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[DJ]


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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:03 am

Lmao I was trying to edit my post and accidentally deleted it

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Enough is enough. Sakurasig
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[DJ]
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[DJ]


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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:15 am

As for Skill. Skill and spam are not as different as you may think.


I'm Itachi.

Lets say I fireball spam someone.
Its effective for about half of their health bar, then they catch on.
They punish me the next time I try it.

Okay, I realize that the ol' fireball ain't gonna work no mo.
So I start doing something different. I punish his cDash with my hero framed U2.
By now his health is very low, and his only chance to come back is with a U3.

I don't let him U3. I'm on my guard for the remainder of his gauge time.
Only reacting to grabs and combos. Using my support to create some type of offense within my defense.

Lets say he got me down low enough for me to use Susan.
I go Susan, I break his guard, then I finish him with a fireball.

Just because I spammed in the beginning doesn't mean I don't have skill.
I took advantage of his ignorance of how to punish it, and then changed my approach when he caught on.
I actually have more skill because I utilized something simple and made it work in my favor.
I was aware of his adaptation and I adapted to the shift. That's skill if Ive ever seen it.

And as a matter of fact, I have seen it. Its happened before. When a spammer sees him spam is no longer working, he'll change his spam to something that will work. That's what I call a skilled spammer.

If fireball spam stops working, cKunai spam. If cKunai spam stops working, U2 spam. By then you should have the match lead already if all of these things worked once. Taking advantage of your opponents weaknesses even if its with spam, takes skill. Spamming blindly and not changing at all even when you're getting punished is not skill, but you cant label spam altogether as skill-less.

------------------------
Enough is enough. Sakurasig
ab
RΛÐÏUS
There's always free cheddar in a mousetrap...its a deal.
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[DJ]
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[DJ]


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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:21 am

Btw the post Skyler was referring to (which I deleted by mistake) was just me ranting, apparently, about what spam is.

I said that doing the same attack over and over is spam and doing a combination of attacks over and over isn't spam.

My examples were:

Itachi using fireball constantly = Spam.

Sasori U2 after SB = Not Spam.

I basically said that people label the wrong things as spam and then complain about them. I called those people scrubs.

Don't listen to Skye, she does not have my mind power. My words carry truth.

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Enough is enough. Sakurasig
ab
RΛÐÏUS
There's always free cheddar in a mousetrap...its a deal.
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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:22 am

Unless the opponent learns to walk to the left?

If you lose to spam, especially DJ's example, you can't complain its your own fault.
However, changing from one bad tactic to another doesn't make a player any more skilled.

If he fails at one thing and moves to another, then one can assume he will fail that as well.
Walking to the left beats out most of DJ's strategy. Thats not a skilled spammer, just an unskilled opponent to the spammer.

A skilled spammer is more like
He spams, but he does it in a safe manner. > A>K>A> a turtle
He spams, but he keeps pressure to avoid counteraction > A>K>A> a rusher
He spams, but he keeps a lead and knows how to work around > A>K>A> a strategist

Not "oh fireball doesn't work, lets punish charges with my U2"
Thats just a garbage player playing someone even worse. Work around it.
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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:25 am

These are all valid points but honestly... fireball spam might work maybe 2-3 times on someone who's got half a brain. In addition to that fireballing in general leaves you pretty open for punishment if they're dumb enough to spam it when you're up close. You've got me on susan though, but that's broken no matter how you look at it.
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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:30 am

Luminssence wrote:
These are all valid points but honestly... fireball spam might work maybe 2-3 times on someone who's got half a brain. In addition to that fireballing in general leaves you pretty open for punishment if they're dumb enough to spam it when you're up close. You've got me on susan though, but that's broken no matter how you look at it.

May rain
Hidan assist
GTFO run like hell
Spam KnJ if cornered
use teleports
Guard the chakra dash
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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:37 am

Even with all of that susan is still broken as hell. If you use both of your assists up and mess up on a knj spamming Susan can deal out some heavy damage.
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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:39 am

Skyler-X wrote:
Unless the opponent learns to walk to the left?

I was giving an extremely basic example, not a legit strategy.
Everyone knows how to punish the things I mentioned, but I was writing from the point of view of two players who do not know every strategy to beat certain types of spam.

Beating a spammy Susan is easy as hell. Beating fireballs is easy as hell.

But whether or not you beat Susan, Susan still has the advantage. Reach and Power.
You can play Susan in a skilled manner and win without spamming.
The tactics you mentioned work against a spamming Susan, but would you know what to do against a Susan who knows how to rape?

------------------------
Enough is enough. Sakurasig
ab
RΛÐÏUS
There's always free cheddar in a mousetrap...its a deal.
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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:48 am

Same as above.
Salamander is, imo, much more frightening than susanoo.
Lasts longer, and has a health lead.

No matter how good a susanoo is, its binded by the common strategies.
I always find time, even against a KnJ spamming one, to shorten their life spans.
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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:02 am

Guys, settle down. Agree to disagree. I'm on both sides.
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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 7:58 am

Susano'o is easily one of the best awakenings, it's absolutely fearsome and has few weaknesses in the hands of a good player. Just because you KnJ and run away and block against a noob doesn't change the fact he is immune to shurikens and once he catches you it's difficult to escape. Without amaterasu Susano'o would not be much of a threat at all, but because of it he is able to get around your block easily. Awakenings aren't all that threatening unless it's a pretty close match though, Itachi has to be pretty damn hurt for him to use it. The mere threat of Susano'o may in fact be better than the awakening itself though, Itachi can easily get off a dashing U2 on anyone who tries to stop him from awakening.

I also agree with DJ about spam, it can be skillful if used properly or as an effective counter. The only thing that's really important to note about spam is that the blame is on you, not the spammer. For spamming to be most effective it should be used against a less skilled opponent. Deidara should continue spamming air combos if he has Pain to potect him and his opponent is not smart enough to counter with shurikens
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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 8:03 am

Skyler-X wrote:
Luminssence wrote:
These are all valid points but honestly... fireball spam might work maybe 2-3 times on someone who's got half a brain. In addition to that fireballing in general leaves you pretty open for punishment if they're dumb enough to spam it when you're up close. You've got me on susan though, but that's broken no matter how you look at it.

May rain
Hidan assist
GTFO run like hell
Spam KnJ if cornered
use teleports
Guard the chakra dash

May rain only works if the Susano'o is an absurd distance from you.
Hidan and Chiyo will help, but only if you have them.
Running will only get you so far, you will still have to deal with amaterasu.
You can spam KnJ all day, but once your cornered your probably not going anywhere.
Guarding the chakra dash and jump blocking his swings works very well, until they use amaterasu.
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PostSubject: Re: Enough is enough.   Enough is enough. Clock14Thu Jan 13, 2011 9:47 pm

Spamming depends on the person your playing, using your u2 after SB everytime you get a SB is considered spam to some people. Using Knj to avoid combos is considered spam to some people, hell in SC using safe pokes to open up guards is considered spamming to some people. People can spam me all they want it doesn't bother me, what bothers me is that its hard as hell to punish moves in this game what with the ole Knj my way out of anything.
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